Do you need a captain's license?

[Julian]

In a discussion with someone about when you need a captains license and they claim:

Julian - No you do not. You only need a six pack license if you are on saltwater or on a body of water that connects to the intro coaster waterway. If you are on a boat that is less than 30 feet long and on a closed freshwater lake you do not need a license besides a drivers license.​

I think this is wrong and that:

Licenses are required in order to legally carry passengers for hire. This includes charters for fishing, sightseeing, diving, transportation, teaching or any use which is considered a “passenger for hire” situation.​

 

[Sbrown]

In a discussion with someone about when you need a captains license and they claim:

Julian - No you do not. You only need a six pack license if you are on saltwater or on a body of water that connects to the intro coaster waterway. If you are on a boat that is less than 30 feet long and on a closed freshwater lake you do not need a license besides a drivers license.​

I think this is wrong and that:

Licenses are required in order to legally carry passengers for hire. This includes charters for fishing, sightseeing, diving, transportation, teaching or any use which is considered a “passenger for hire” situation.​

I believe you are correct, Julian. Technically this also includes if you make people pitch in for gas, beer, bait, etc.

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

To legally carry passengers on a vessel you own (assuming it’s uninspected) you need a 6pack OUPV. Your OUPV can be for inland, near coastal, or Great Lakes. Further more you need to be enrolled in a random drug testing program.

Your local USCG would be happy to explain further. And fine offenders up to 90k.

 

[zipper]

An OUPV 6 pack Captain’s license is required on inland waters if you are hired to take up to 6 people on sightseeing, fishing, diving etc.

Screenshotted this from the Mariners learning system.



I am currently using this course to test for my OUPV 6 pack Captain’s license.

 

[Julian]

An OUPV 6 pack Captain’s license is required on inland waters if you are hired to take up to 6 people on sightseeing, fishing, diving etc.

Screenshotted this from the Mariners learning system.

View attachment 172592

I am currently using this course to test for my OUPV 6 pack Captain’s license.

Curious to hear what you think of their program and how hard the test is.

 

[Beachbummer]

I believe you are correct, Julian. Technically this also includes if you make people pitch in for gas, beer, bait, etc.

I'm interested in the reasoning or law mandating this. I think even private airplane pilots can split cost of fuel work passengers. I can't imagine Maritime rules would be more stringent on splitting cost of fuel than the FAA.

I think a passenger for hire is someone that pays for the privilege, which is different than sharing in an expense like money for fuel or food.

I think the biggest hurdle to the 6pack is the hours. You are supposed to need 4+ hours of boating Not at anchor to count that day's hours.

There is a lot of test prep available that makes it seem reachable with some preparation.

• Must be at least 18 years old.
• Must be able to document 360 days of experience on a vessel, of which at least 90 days must be on Near Coastal/Ocean waters otherwise license will be limited to Inland Waters ONLY. (See: What Counts as Sea Service)
• 90 days of sea service must be within the last 3 years of when you apply.
• 90 days of sea service must be on Ocean or Near Coastal waters or otherwise the license will be limited to Inland Waters only.
• If you are not a U.S. Citizen, you can apply for this license but it will be limited tonnage and restricted to undocumented vessels.

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

An OUPV 6 pack Captain’s license is required on inland waters if you are hired to take up to 6 people on sightseeing, fishing, diving etc.

Screenshotted this from the Mariners learning system.

View attachment 172592

I am currently using this course to test for my OUPV 6 pack Captain’s license.

I used them but would recommend going for in person course if you can commit the time. There is so much going on to get the license and most schools cover it all from the test exam/first aid/cpr/drug screening/filling out the application (hardest part lol).

As for the exam, there were a lot of questions that were not in the study material. One section I barley passed though I pass all 4 sections in my first attempt.

 

[Beachbummer]

How did you make the hours? Did you use your busting experience hours? Or do you work on the field? Or elsewhere? Thanks for sharing.

 

[zipper]

Curious to hear what you think of their program and how hard the test is.

I started it on Jan 1. I have a year to use the material and test for the license. I rolled right thru the study material and quizzes in January. You need a 90% score on your quizzes to move on to the next section. I got to the Navigation section, the last section, by the beginning of Feb. but I needed to spend more time in the woods getting the sugarbush ready for the season, so I have put it on the back burner until time allows me to finish the material. I don't have much more course material to complete. Once I finish it, I will run thru it again to set the material firmly in my mind. There is a lot of material to learn, significance of different colors and periods of lights, day signs, shapes, signals, rules of the road, firefighting etc. Here is a typical page.



I am currently in no hurry. I plan to take the test sometime this Summer. I did buy the program while they offered a 25% discount off the normal course price of $495



They do have another current 20% discount promo that pops up on my news feed frequently.

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

How did you make the hours? Did you use your busting experience hours? Or do you work on the field? Or elsewhere? Thanks for sharing.

I did it to the best of my abilities. I had to provide proof of ownership for previous boats I owned. You fill out one form per boat and all boats need to add up to the required time.

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

@zipper that’s a great price.

These fees also need to be paid.

First Aid/CPR Training - $95 (has to be an approved in person class, online Groupon specials don’t count…. Ask me how I know lol)
TWIC - $130
Drug Screening - $90
Eye Exam - Depends in Insurance
Physical Exam - Depends in Insurance
Application Fees - $130

 

[zipper]

@zipper that’s a great price.

These fees also need to be paid.

First Aid/CPR Training - $95 (has to be an approved in person class, online Groupon specials don’t count…. Ask me how I know lol)
TWIC - $130
Drug Screening - $90
Eye Exam - Depends in Insurance
Physical Exam - Depends in Insurance
Application Fees - $130

Yes, aware of this. I had first aid/cpr training as a rescue diver, but that was 1982 and I know they teach it differently now, the sequence of chest compressions and breaths have changed since I practiced on that dummy “Rescue Anne”.

 

[Julian]

I did it to the best of my abilities. I had to provide proof of ownership for previous boats I owned. You fill out one form per boat and all boats need to add up to the required time.

I was under the impression you could also count time on other boats you didn't own? (Not sure if matters in my case)

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

I was under the impression you could also count time on other boats you didn't own? (Not sure if matters in my case)

You could but it becomes more of a pain. You need the owner to sign off and of course that vessel details and proof of their ownership.

 

[Julian]

Reply on this discussion from elsewhere:

Julian - with all due respect, you are incorrect. I have been in contact with Texas parks and wildlife dozens of times over the past few years and am 100% in compliance. I am friends with all the other rental company owners and we all talk frequently and trust me when I say you are mistaken.​

​

Is it possible Texas can over ride the US Coastguard rules?

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

Reply on this discussion from elsewhere:

Julian - with all due respect, you are incorrect. I have been in contact with Texas parks and wildlife dozens of times over the past few years and am 100% in compliance. I am friends with all the other rental company owners and we all talk frequently and trust me when I say you are mistaken.​

​

Is it possible Texas can over ride the US Coastguard rules?

I don’t know for sure 100% but I would 99% doubt it. A quick call to the auxiliary office would awnser that.

 

[tdonoughue]

No.

But the USCG and those laws has jurisdiction only in 'navigable waters'. (Congress can only regulate interstate commerce, not intrastate.) So your inland local lake is very likely not 'navigable waters' and then is under only the Texas laws/regulations. But if you are in the Gulf, that is navigable waters and USCG regs apply. Mississippi River? Navigable. Ship Channel? Navigable. Lake Conroe? Not navigable...

Edited to add: See 33 CFR Sec. 329.4

 

[zipper]

Reply on this discussion from elsewhere:

Julian - with all due respect, you are incorrect. I have been in contact with Texas parks and wildlife dozens of times over the past few years and am 100% in compliance. I am friends with all the other rental company owners and we all talk frequently and trust me when I say you are mistaken.​

​

Is it possible Texas can over ride the US Coastguard rules?

No, but well said by @tdonoughue above. What type of business does he operate?

 

[Sbrown]

I'm interested in the reasoning or law mandating this. I think even private airplane pilots can split cost of fuel work passengers. I can't imagine Maritime rules would be more stringent on splitting cost of fuel than the FAA.

I think a passenger for hire is someone that pays for the privilege, which is different than sharing in an expense like money for fuel or food.

I think the biggest hurdle to the 6pack is the hours. You are supposed to need 4+ hours of boating Not at anchor to count that day's hours.

There is a lot of test prep available that makes it seem reachable with some preparation.

• Must be at least 18 years old.
• Must be able to document 360 days of experience on a vessel, of which at least 90 days must be on Near Coastal/Ocean waters otherwise license will be limited to Inland Waters ONLY. (See: What Counts as Sea Service)
• 90 days of sea service must be within the last 3 years of when you apply.
• 90 days of sea service must be on Ocean or Near Coastal waters or otherwise the license will be limited to Inland Waters only.
• If you are not a U.S. Citizen, you can apply for this license but it will be limited tonnage and restricted to undocumented vessels.

The reason is there are too many unlicensed boaters who take people out fishing, etc for a fee and then attempt to exploit the loophole by claiming the "fee" was just gas money or whatever. Yes, it is a technicality, but it is there for them to use against someone if they need to. Obviously, you would have to be really blatant or someone filed a complaint against you for them to even be looking at you in the first place.

As for the FAA rules, I don't see the relevance one way or the other. Comparing apples to oranges in my opinion. Swinging for left field, so to speak.

 

[Julian]

My reply:

Jason with all due respect, Texas law states "It is unlawful to Fail to comply with the USCG Inland Rules of the Road". CGROR require that you have your license with you when carrying people for hire.

I'm sure your local wildlife guys will line up to pay your fines and court costs when/if the shit hits the fan! Not to mention line up to defend you and say s the CG laws don't apply.

Everyone chooses the risks they are willing to take....your insurance carrier is who I'd want the answer from in writing. If they say you are good...and you have good insurance and a large umbrella policy....then I'd be more at ease.

Operation of Your Boat — Texas Parks & Wildlife Department

tpwd.texas.gov