Mid-Cabin Speaker Placement--Opinions Appreciated

[JDRacing]

So, I've been through the other threads on speaker placement, particularly the long thread started by @Julian, all of which were helpful. My question here is very specific.

As background, at this point, I'm just about done with the install of an additional Wet Sounds HTX-6 amp, and all the harnesses, etc, I needed to make to separate each speaker onto its own channel on my 2018 212X. I've got dozens of hours into this project at this point.

Here's a picture of the amp placement. Stock HTX-6 DSP on the port, and the added HTX-6 on the starboard. The starboard amp is mounted on 1/2" seaboard which is firmly attached (construction adhesive compatible with fiberglass) under the carpet. It looks pretty much like the factory might have built it if they offered a two amp setup. As an aside, the sound is vastly improved over the stock system, which itself had all sorts of wiring problems from the factory:



Following a great suggestion by @Julian to me in another thread, I went with the 6 channel amp so I had an extra pair of channels for mid-cabin speakers, and I'm going to add them as part of this project (which is otherwise almost completed).

The ideal placement would be above the cup holders behind the throttles, and there's a spot on the helm side that would accommodate it, but the port side has no room in the black area, because of the aluminum handle, name plate, and other items I don't want to eliminate or disturb. Going to put in 6.5 Wet Sounds. So here's the question:

Which location on the helm side? The forward position in the below picture raises the speaker up a bit, but it's not symmetrical with the other side, which will be a bit further aft because of how the consoles are designed. The aft position is obviously lower, but I can place a speaker directly opposite it on the port side. Wife likes the symmetry. I like the higher placement, even though it's father forward of where the port speaker could go (but I can get the heights pretty close):



Thoughts appreciated.

Jeff

 

[Redneck_4Play]

I've got a 2014 212x and put JL 7.7's mid-cabin. The one on the starboard side I put in the place you've identified to the front of the throttles. I think having it up higher projects the sound better to the passenger side. This is an old picture when is was being installed but shows placement.

 

[Jaylex]

Not sure if youll reallly hear any differences either way, so flip a coin or go with what the wife thinks.

I have my M770s in the lower position, had I thought it out might have toyed with diff placemnt but anything besides up high near the throttles isnt gonna make a huge diff for the two locations your suggesting. I do have some tower speakers and those def add more voulme up high so that def makes a diff to my ears as well.

 

[Julian]

I agree with Jaylex, if you can't fit it in by the throttles (not sure why you can't) either lower spot it good, but I'd lean towards the one further forward.

I might also look into if you can find a plastic angled speaker ring to point the speaker better...something like:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/MDF-Speaker-rings-Angled-Large-size-6-5-/160396269015

 

[JDRacing]

Thanks very much to each of you for your comments. Will be going with the forward position.

@Julian, as far as why it can't go up at the throttle level, there is no corresponding place on the port side on the 212X, at least for 2018. There is a model name plate and also a machined aluminum handle, among other things, in the way that I do not want to eliminate or move.

 

[Jaylex]

Those speaker rings look pretty sweet...at the very least u should get a slight bump in volume if you can point them optimally to elevate the sound some.

 

[JDRacing]

Completed the mid-cabin speaker installation today, as well as most of the rest of the addition of a second HTX-6 amp and wiring to separate each speaker onto its own channel. Couple of things worth noting.

I bought and then struggled with the Harbor Freight hole saw set, specifically the 5" saw. It took forever to cut the starboard hole, and the saw was clearly getting dull towards the end. I started trying to cut the port hole with it and after about 20 minutes realized I wasn't making much progress, with less than 30% of the thickness of the hole cut. Went out and bough a Milwaukee "Hole Dozer" 5" hole saw and a quick release arbor from Home Depot, and finished up the job in 5 minutes. Night and day difference. I'm all for saving a buck, but there's no comparison in how the two saws cut fiberglass. It was $50 dollars well spent, and I'd suggest anyone else doing a project like this start with a quality saw.

I changed out all of the cabin speakers for Wet Sounds Revo 6's, rather than the 65i's the boat came with. Substantial improvement in clarity at higher volumes, and much better bass extension. Plus, my wife really liked the green LED feature, consistent with the green theme of the boat. I hooked the LED's to the courtesy light power sources, so they go on and off and dim with the courtesy lights.

The addition of the mid-cabin speakers is a significant upgrade. After adding the second amp and straightening out all of Yamaha's wiring screw ups (see this thread for details: https://jetboaters.net/threads/2018-212x-audio-system-brand-setup-change-from-2017.19663/) there was an obvious "dead spot in the boat right at the helm and port console seats. Before I put the mid cabin speakers in, I could clearly hear the bow speakers and the aft cabin speakers as separate pairs, and it sounded a bit like I was sitting in a hole right between them. With the addition of the mid-cabin speakers, the whole cabin blends together and is much fuller and less localized. Really happy with the results.

By the way, as far as straightening out Yamaha's complete mess of an audio wiring job on the 2018 212X, I've been in contact with Wet Sounds. Given the dozens and dozens of hours I've spent figuring out and fixing what was wrong by making a seemingly endless series of new wiring harnesses, I had a great exchange of information with Wet Sounds' OEM manager. I won't go into detail, but suffice it to say we both learned a lot about the problems with the sound system on these boats. My thread cited above details only the problems I had figured out by then. I found more after that. If you have a 2018 212X and the audio doesn't sound right, PM me, and we can jump on a call, because I can probably save you (and your dealer) a lot of time.

Below are a couple of pictures of the starboard and port speaker installations. You will note that the SeaDek is removed, because one can't fully appreciate the discomfort and pain of stepping, kneeling or laying on the snaps with the SeaDek installed.

Thanks again for all of the input and advice.

 

[Brent Markham]

Nice and clean! Looks great!!

 

[JDRacing]

Nice and clean! Looks great!!

Thanks for the kind comments.

 

[swatski]

Completed the mid-cabin speaker installation today, as well as most of the rest of the addition of a second HTX-6 amp and wiring to separate each speaker onto its own channel. Couple of things worth noting.

I bought and then struggled with the Harbor Freight hole saw set, specifically the 5" saw. It took forever to cut the starboard hole, and the saw was clearly getting dull towards the end. I started trying to cut the port hole with it and after about 20 minutes realized I wasn't making much progress, with less than 30% of the thickness of the hole cut. Went out and bough a Milwaukee "Hole Dozer" 5" hole saw and a quick release arbor from Home Depot, and finished up the job in 5 minutes. Night and day difference. I'm all for saving a buck, but there's no comparison in how the two saws cut fiberglass. It was $50 dollars well spent, and I'd suggest anyone else doing a project like this start with a quality saw.

I changed out all of the cabin speakers for Wet Sounds Revo 6's, rather than the 651's the boat came with. Substantial improvement in clarity at higher volumes, and much better bass extension. Plus, my wife really liked the green LED feature, consistent with the green theme of the boat. I hooked the LED's to the courtesy light power sources, so they go on and off and dim with the courtesy lights.

The addition of the mid-cabin speakers is a significant upgrade. After adding the second amp and straightening out all of Yamaha's wiring screw ups (see this thread for details: https://jetboaters.net/threads/2018-212x-audio-system-brand-setup-change-from-2017.19663/) there was an obvious "dead spot in the boat right at the helm and port console seats. Before I put the mid cabin speakers in, I could clearly hear the bow speakers and the aft cabin speakers as separate pairs, and it sounded a bit like I was sitting in a hole right between them. With the addition of the mid-cabin speakers, the whole cabin blends together and is much fuller and less localized. Really happy with the results.

By the way, as far as straightening out Yamaha's complete mess of an audio wiring job on the 2018 212X, I've been in contact with Wet Sounds. Given the dozens and dozens of hours I've spent figuring out and fixing what was wrong by making a seemingly endless series of new wiring harnesses, I had a great exchange of information with Wet Sounds' OEM manager. I won't go into detail, but suffice it to say we both learned a lot about the problems with the sound system on these boats. My thread cited above details only the problems I had figured out by then. I found more after that. If you have a 2018 212X and the audio doesn't sound right, PM me, and we can jump on a call, because I can probably save you (and your dealer) a lot of time.

Below are a couple of pictures of the starboard and port speaker installations. You will note that the SeaDek is removed, because one can't fully appreciate the discomfort and pain of stepping, kneeling or laying on the snaps with the SeaDek installed.

Thanks again for all of the input and advice.

View attachment 85253

View attachment 85255

Great upgrades, and thanks for sharing the lessons learned!

--

 

[Julian]

Nice job! Added this to the stereo mods FAQ!

 

[JDRacing]

Thanks again all!

 

[JDRacing]

I was thinking, particularly since this thread is now preserved in the FAQ's, I'd add a couple more comments in connection with adding the mid-cabin speakers and the second amp.

When cutting the new holes in our 2018 212X, we of course looked behind the area we wanted to cut. On the starboard side, this included my wife (fortunately 4'11") crawling into the helm console with a flashlight to have a look before drilling the pilot hole. Turns out in the space we wanted to put that speaker, there's a big split loom, presumably carrying most of the wiring for the Connext system as well as the audio from the head unit. It was secured with heavy cable ties and anchored pretty solidly in place. We cut two of the cable ties, which allowed her to hold the loom back several inches from the speaker location. She spent the entire time I was using the hole saw standing vigil to make sure there was no way I was going to saw through the loom.

After the hole was cut, I had to drill the speaker mounting screw holes, one of which would have gone right through the loom if it wasn't being held out of the way. Even though we didn't hit the loom, when she stopped holding the loom back, it would lay near that screw, pretty much no matter what we did or how we re-secured it with zip ties. The solution we came up with was to get some 7/32 windshield washer tubing and put it over the screw prior to securing the loom in place. Worked out fine. Here's a picture of the loom, the back of the speaker (from the side), and the screws (we put tubing on two of them). The lower screw was the most worrisome. You can see the rubber tube, which sticks out well beyond end of the screw, almost acting as a stand-off against the loom, although it's really not putting any pressure on the loom at all--just laying against it. While you'd think it might be easy to just route the loom below the speaker, it didn't look like it would be; hence the tubing.



By the way, everything you see in that picture, loose wires, drain tube (from the helm console cup holder, so liquid doesn't drip on the head unit ), etc. is all OEM. You can see my rubber insulator in the middle of the picture. The screw protrudes less than half way through that rubber tube. As mentioned, even with this setup, the loom is not hard against the rubber by any means.

Fortunately, there was absolutely nothing behind the location for the port mid-cabin speaker.

As far as how the amps were set up with the 4 sets of cabin speakers (including the swim deck speakers in that count), the sound bar, and the sub, I ended up running all 4 sets of cabin speakers on the front channels of the HU, and the sound bar as the lone speakers on the rear channels. I did this so that I could use the fader to broadcast louder music to those being towed/surfing without blasting out those sitting on the boat when turning the volume way up. That sound bar is LOUD with its own dedicated amp channels when you want it to be. The sub gets its signal from the rear channel, via a low pass filter on one of the amps, just as it did from the factory.

This was not a free (or even particularly cheap) project, either in terms of $ or time, but the results are truly remarkable compared to how the boat was delivered. Including the 3 pairs of new Wet Sounds Revo 6's to replace the Wet Sounds 65i's that came stock with the boat, and the new HTX-6 amp, plus 14 gauge tinned speaker wire and other supplies, I'm probably into the job $1700. If I had stuck with the original 65i's and just added another pair of those to the mid-cabin, the job would have been under $900, and I know it would have gotten most of the same results.) But it went from an incorrectly-wired system that, as a result, sounded like it was worth maybe $1000 on a good day (even though it had $2000+ in Wet Sounds hardware from the factory), to something that, to my ears, sounds like a $5000 system, based on what I've seen friends pay to have their cars'/boats' audio systems custom installed. Not top of the line by any means, but more than sufficient for what I was looking for. The difference is beyond night and day.

Jeff

 

[Bearsar240]

I was thinking, particularly since this thread is now preserved in the FAQ's, I'd add a couple more comments in connection with adding the mid-cabin speakers and the second amp.

When cutting the new holes in our 2018 212X, we of course looked behind the area we wanted to cut. On the starboard side, this included my wife (fortunately 4'11") crawling into the helm console with a flashlight to have a look before drilling the pilot hole. Turns out in the space we wanted to put that speaker, there's a big split loom, presumably carrying most of the wiring for the Connext system as well as the audio from the head unit. It was secured with heavy cable ties and anchored pretty solidly in place. We cut two of the cable ties, which allowed her to hold the loom back several inches from the speaker location. She spent the entire time I was using the hole saw standing vigil to make sure there was no way I was going to saw through the loom.

After the hole was cut, I had to drill the speaker mounting screw holes, one of which would have gone right through the loom if it wasn't being held out of the way. Even though we didn't hit the loom, when she stopped holding the loom back, it would lay near that screw, pretty much no matter what we did or how we re-secured it with zip ties. The solution we came up with was to get some 7/32 windshield washer tubing and put it over the screw prior to securing the loom in place. Worked out fine. Here's a picture of the loom, the back of the speaker (from the side), and the screws (we put tubing on two of them). The lower screw was the most worrisome. You can see the rubber tube, which sticks out well beyond end of the screw, almost acting as a stand-off against the loom, although it's really not putting any pressure on the loom at all--just laying against it. While you'd think it might be easy to just route the loom below the speaker, it didn't look like it would be; hence the tubing.

View attachment 85396

By the way, everything you see in that picture, loose wires, drain tube (from the helm console cup holder, so liquid doesn't drip on the head unit ), etc. is all OEM. You can see my rubber insulator in the middle of the picture. The screw protrudes less than half way through that rubber tube. As mentioned, even with this setup, the loom is not hard against the rubber by any means.

Fortunately, there was absolutely nothing behind the location for the port mid-cabin speaker.

As far as how the amps were set up with the 4 sets of cabin speakers (including the swim deck speakers in that count), the sound bar, and the sub, I ended up running all 4 sets of cabin speakers on the front channels of the HU, and the sound bar as the lone speakers on the rear channels. I did this so that I could use the fader to broadcast louder music to those being towed/surfing without blasting out those sitting on the boat when turning the volume way up. That sound bar is LOUD with its own dedicated amp channels when you want it to be. The sub gets its signal from the rear channel, via a low pass filter on one of the amps, just as it did from the factory.

This was not a free (or even particularly cheap) project, either in terms of $ or time, but the results are truly remarkable compared to how the boat was delivered. Including the 3 pairs of new Wet Sounds Revo 6's to replace the Wet Sounds 65i's that came stock with the boat, and the new HTX-6 amp, plus 14 gauge tinned speaker wire and other supplies, I'm probably into the job $1700. If I had stuck with the original 65i's and just added another pair of those to the mid-cabin, the job would have been under $900, and I know it would have gotten most of the same results.) But it went from an incorrectly-wired system that, as a result, sounded like it was worth maybe $1000 on a good day (even though it had $2000+ in Wet Sounds hardware from the factory), to something that, to my ears, sounds like a $5000 system, based on what I've seen friends pay to have their cars'/boats' audio systems custom installed. Not top of the line by any means, but more than sufficient for what I was looking for. The difference is beyond night and day.

Jeff

Do you have your stock 65i's? If so do you want to sell them?

 

[JDRacing]

Thanks for the inquiry, but no they are not for sale. I put them in the RV. Quite an improvement over the stock junk they installed there.

 

[MDicey]

Hi @JDRacing i am trying to follow your lead here and fix the stereo in my 2018 212X but can’t find anywhere how exactly you rewired the out cables from the stock Wet Sounds amp that came with the boat?

 

[JDRacing]

So, it's been a few years, but the original Yamaha wiring for the DSP Wet Sounds amp (new for 2018) had a lot of Yamaha factory problems.

I basically rewired my entire audio system on the output side of the amp. The original DSP HTX 6 now runs the bow speakers on channels 1 & 2, the sound bar on channels 3 & 4, and channels 5 and 6 are bridged and run the sub. All the other speakers are running off of two new amps I've added (I've added one more since this thread to power a pair of REV 8's that I mounted on either side of the sound bar).

Depending when your boat was built in 2018 will dictate what components were used and how it is wired. My boat was built right during the transition from Polk speakers to Wet Sounds, and the transition to a DSP Wet Sounds amp from Polk. The Yamaha factory harnesses for the new Wet Sounds components were all screwed up. I think the only factory output wiring I am still using go to the sub.

Jeff

 

[MDicey]

So, it's been a few years, but the original Yamaha wiring for the DSP Wet Sounds amp (new for 2018) had a lot of Yamaha factory problems.

I basically rewired my entire audio system on the output side of the amp. The original DSP HTX 6 now runs the bow speakers on channels 1 & 2, the sound bar on channels 3 & 4, and channels 5 and 6 are bridged and run the sub. All the other speakers are running off of two new amps I've added (I've added one more since this thread to power a pair of REV 8's that I mounted on either side of the sound bar).

Depending when your boat was built in 2018 will dictate what components were used and how it is wired. My boat was built right during the transition from Polk speakers to Wet Sounds, and the transition to a DSP Wet Sounds amp from Polk. The Yamaha factory harnesses for the new Wet Sounds components were all screwed up. I think the only factory output wiring I am still using go to the sub.

Jeff

Thanks @JDRacing I’m in the middle of the transition to Wet Sounds I think. Same setup but not quite as badly wired!
So as a starter it would be ideal to rewire the original to as you have it with individual channels per speaker, as well as the sub which is bridged and runs as it should - No rewiring needed? and then add another amp in to run rear cabin speakers (a pair of channels) the swim deck speakers (another pair of channels) as well as a spare set for a pair of speakers mid cabin (the third set of channels). Does the second amp (and third in your case) run off the HU outputs? Love the fact that I am writing this from the middle of a cold winters day in New Zealand whilst you are enjoying summer in the US (mine I think is the only 212X in NZ!) Thanks for your help with this.
Matt

 

[JDRacing]

Hope the weather is decent in NZ right now, albeit cold.

Your plan sounds good. Assuming you have the Polk PA4A HU (Yamaha changed HU's near the end of 2018), you will find two pairs of RCA outputs (4 channels total. R/L Front/Rear) behind the helm. You can run them to a separate amp to do what you are suggesting.

Good luck and let us know how it works out.

Jeff

 

[SCP1]

So, I've been through the other threads on speaker placement, particularly the long thread started by @Julian, all of which were helpful. My question here is very specific.

As background, at this point, I'm just about done with the install of an additional Wet Sounds HTX-6 amp, and all the harnesses, etc, I needed to make to separate each speaker onto its own channel on my 2018 212X. I've got dozens of hours into this project at this point.

Here's a picture of the amp placement. Stock HTX-6 DSP on the port, and the added HTX-6 on the starboard. The starboard amp is mounted on 1/2" seaboard which is firmly attached (construction adhesive compatible with fiberglass) under the carpet. It looks pretty much like the factory might have built it if they offered a two amp setup. As an aside, the sound is vastly improved over the stock system, which itself had all sorts of wiring problems from the factory:

View attachment 85122

Following a great suggestion by @Julian to me in another thread, I went with the 6 channel amp so I had an extra pair of channels for mid-cabin speakers, and I'm going to add them as part of this project (which is otherwise almost completed).

The ideal placement would be above the cup holders behind the throttles, and there's a spot on the helm side that would accommodate it, but the port side has no room in the black area, because of the aluminum handle, name plate, and other items I don't want to eliminate or disturb. Going to put in 6.5 Wet Sounds. So here's the question:

Which location on the helm side? The forward position in the below picture raises the speaker up a bit, but it's not symmetrical with the other side, which will be a bit further aft because of how the consoles are designed. The aft position is obviously lower, but I can place a speaker directly opposite it on the port side. Wife likes the symmetry. I like the higher placement, even though it's father forward of where the port speaker could go (but I can get the heights pretty close):

View attachment 85123

Thoughts appreciated.

Jeff

Ok, I found your post. Did you consider this location? Not my write up, he went with the Polks which are not very deep, I’m looking to go with something similar to what you went with. I keep going back and forth if I should add these mid cabin speakers.