need advice re: garage expansion

[Speedling]

Ok! I am finally in my new house! Still unpacking, but have been working on ideas for expanding from before we even put in an offer. House is really cool '60's house full brick ranch with a 20x20 courtyard in the middle. Big double doors in front, acre of property, 5 minutes from our lake (2 minutes farther than last house) and very secluded and wooded.

Anyways, the two things we want: more boat, errr, i mean garage space, and more room for master bed/bath with hopefully a walk in closet. The current garage is 24x24 and hardly fits the boat. I have a corner lot, so you have a driveway going out the side, but they still put the door to the back, which is horrid for trying to put the boat in! It's a one lane driveway as well. Took half an hour wiggling it in. For spring i am hoping to get at least a canopy setup for it outside but i want my baby inside!

So, if i fill in the corner i would be adding on 24x32. Would love to have a room above the garage and have it big enough for master bedroom and bathroom. Total garage size would be 50' wide. Currently have either a 5/12 or 4/12 pitch roof. Would this work? If i go over the house and match roof pitches, total new truss area would be 50' x 43'. 50' would not be too big a span because there is a wall there from closing the corner off and i would just open up a 12' opening or something between the two which works well if i want to heat half the garage only. This would match current roof lines and we are looking at adding decorative wood beams to the courtyard to continue the peak line in a trellis fashion. Also, garage doors would face the street so it would be much easier to back into.

Option 2 (they can be tweaked obviosly) is to add to the side where the garage door is currently, again moving the garage doors to face the street (remeber, corner lot) and this would then be 26x36 but the back 4' would be a sort of hallway. Upstairs room is possible with a steeper roof which is possible because it would look like a detached garage with connection between.

All 8' doors would be nice but mean the header needs to be in the gable and ceiling needs to be higher for the track. I would need it in order to fit the boat with tower folded down. I prefer attached garage vs detached so i can keep my stuff where i work on things and tinker. Right now my lawnmowers are outside in a shed and i want them inside and the kids toys outside.

I will draw what i can when i can but am having a hard time finding a decent program to draw it up so i may need to back to my drafting classes and do it old school.

Thanks in advanced as any input is greatly appreciated before i spend this kinda money!

 

[Julian]

Hard to tell from what you are describing.....don't you have a floor plan for the house and lot?

 

[Speedling]

I do have a survey but after closing and receiving a copy i have calles the survey company because they just forwarded the one from the '60's which is handwritten and is very very sloppy to the point where dimensions are hard to make out.
It's also in an adobe reader format so i have to extract a jpg from it best ican.

 

[Murf'n'surf]

Got pics? The right engineer can draft up anything that will work with local codes.

 

[Jim Robeson]

Are you allowed to build a separate out building?? If you are sitting on an acre of property, you should have room to have a nice shop that would house your boat with room to spare. But that is assuming that is not against any neighborhood rules.

 

[Bruce]

New trusses, decking and roof for 50'x43' sounds expensive to me. My 44'x40' probably cost $15K and that was in Arkansas. I am assuming that you have code enforcement to worry about and higher labor rates.

 

[Speedling]

Working on pics tomorrow as i have a meeting i chair tonight for church.
Out building is somewhat not feasible because of the corner lot and the orientation of the septic field. I can diagram that once i sit at the computer for a bit of time.

You are right about the cost of trusses etc. Of i do the demo myself it will probably cost anoit $20k. I am using up a few favors for the walls and electrical and plumbing. Roof stuff i will be outside the favor zone. Rough estimate for option one is currently about $50k and i don't think that is the most economical.

 

[Bruce]

Do you feel that you would gain sufficient equity to justify the $50k investment?

 

[Speedling]

Do you feel that you would gain sufficient equity to justify the $50k investment?

Sufficient? I have the smallest house in the subdivision. I bought for $208k and everyone else has more square footage and closer to $300k price tags with a few closer to the $500k range.
I will be living here for 15-20 years. It's why we bought this house. We assumed this expansion in the first three years. If we don't, then we will be pretty crowded with the garage.
So is it justifiable? To me, yes, if I'm happy with the results. It is more than I had figured on cost wise, but that's no surprise.

 

[txav8r]

If you update the kitchen and master bed/bath, along with the garage expansion, it sounds like your still in the market for that neighborhood. Try to maintain the character of the original neighborhood. If you stay there for the term you suggest, it is just a wash as to the upgrade cost I imagine. Bring on the pics, getting the perspective from afar sometimes opens up new ideas! Congrats on the new digs @Speedling , sounds like a fun project!

 

[Speedling]

Well one concept puts master bath and bed along with office upstairs. We will certainly be doing the kitchen when funds allow but this is taking priority as it is the biggest fund killer

 

[Murf'n'surf]

You could always install the old kitchen equipment into the new kitchen area with plywood cabinets until you get the $ to finish it. Some people are willing to living with a mock up kitchen and some wives would shoot me for even thinking it!

 

[Speedling]

Yeah, i don't have the type that would be ok with plywood cabinets. She babysits to make money from home which means people are in and out of our house all the time. She is also the host for a great many family and friend functions so she is a little particular on looks of things.

 

[MikeyL]

First of all, BIG Congrats on the new home @Speedling . I remember how exciting these days can be.
I would like to offer a suggestion to try & be of help. When you are even CONSIDERING cost numbers in the range of $ 50K to $100K, you would be well advised to get some architectural drawings done. Even if they are only conceptual drawings" BY A PRO. That way, you can receive better advice from pros when you are discussing/choosing the correct path to take.

Otherwise, we have seen way too many instances where plans were thought out mentally, and when projects were completed, bystanders stood back and asked: "WHAT were these people even THINKING ????"

Just my 2 cents worth to try and be of some help. Good Luck whatever direction you take. And I feel sure I speak for all of us, we would be excited to watch your future project become a reality with posted photos if and when you do begin. Many Great wishes your way, and sure hope y'all thoroughly enjoy the new home ! Mikey Lulejian - Lake Oconee, GA

 

[Speedling]

@MikeyL Totally agree with you there! Luckily my father has been doing that for over 30 years My uncle and him used to co-own our masonry company but before they did that they General Contracted and so he has a lot of experience doing these type of things. He's actually out after the Survey company telling them how horrid (and possibly illegal) the survey is that was done for the house.
Anyways, I just took a google snapshot of my house and drew on it quickly so you guys see what I'm saying a little more clearly.
It's a ranch, with a 20x20 hole in the middle. Awesome room, and hope to deck that thing out after I do this addition.
1. Fills in the corner of house/garage. Would require extra permit to move the driveway due to ditch restrictions there, but takes minimal wall construction. Allows for a large room to be constructed above the garages. Part of my concern is that it would be towering over the house since the house roof lines stop where the courtyard is and therefore the peak would be 5-7' different if I span the whole garage. If no room is to be put up there, the red addition on the back of the house would be a future addition we would like to do to give ourselves a better laundry room, office, and master bed setup. We saved some money from selling the last house, but the last house layout had a bigger master which we did love, and we would love to have it back IN THIS HOUSE. Putting new trusses for a room all the way back to the courtyard would make a very large room upstairs, but would also cost a lot (of time, money, and both) due to the removing and bracing the current ceilings and removing the roof etc. to do it. This is the real cost here.

2. Puts the garage off the north end of the house. Driveway would not require extra permit to cross the ditch. A little more wall construction, but putting a gabled end there allows for the 8' garage door. I would probably put a clip or angle in the ceiling to have 9 or 10 foot ceilings inside as well. That's details. The garage door currently is on the north side of the house where the car is, so turning a 90 degree corner with the boat from a one lane driveway is next to impossible because of bushes and such that I can't even run over to make it work. This version doesn't leave room for attic room, but does have storage up there if desired. This is a lot cheaper because there is no removal of roof etc. needed. It also gives the wife an entry way that's decent to the back but I wasn't going to try and detail that out here. Straight shot back to the garage, just no attic room like we were hoping unless we drastically change the roof lines.

3. Detached something. It would require buried lines. It would require removing or moving the pool. It would require some sort of driveway back there. It would require me to trudge through the snow to get to my precious boat. It would also be the most subject to boundry lines. It would also be closest to power lines so height could be an issue. This is probably the easiest to do, quickest to do, and although it would require my boat and summer equipment to be far away from the house, it would also keep my stuff away from the kids stuff. Permits for this would most likely (going off of a neighbor and a friend that lives next subdivision over) difficult to get and would require a variance. I also had the thought (since my power already went out for 16 hours this past Sunday) that running heavy gauge cable to the garage and being able to have the generator over there somehow may be of benefit to power the house from there. I don't like detached garages. It would mean that I can't go out in the winter to work on things in a heated garage. Instead I have to get on winter gear and go "out". I do a lot of that. It would also be a pain to heat whereas an attached garage is always heated due to the house. I like my boat heated. This is the cheapest, but it may be the most difficult due to logistics in my mind.

I hope the picture helps a bit! 1 is blue, 2 yellow, 3 green. Current drive is white, pink is for the second addition and grey is for the addition 1.
This is an acre or property. I tried hugging my boundries with the picture best I could.

Thanks!
Speedling

 

[Speedling]

Looking at the property on my way out, the west side of green garage 3 is probably 5 foot or so from property line, or the neighbor planted a few bushes in my property. Also, since the power lines are hard to see, it runs along that same line to my north west corner which feeds 5 houses from there. This brings easment issues into question but can be taken care of by moving pool. Survey sux and doesn't show easment properly. At work again (yay for ten hours off, 4 spent with my kids) so i will probably not sit down at the computer again until sunday to do that.

 

[MikeyL]

Nice post (above) @Speedling ...... NOW we're talkin' !

By the way ..... I seriously vote # 3, understanding why TODAY you feel it may be the least desirable. I am not a fan of "piling stuff on" to a home in order to make it make the space more functional. Many times "piling stuff on" destroys the "character and feel" of the home. Play with your toys. Have fun. But do it away from your main living space. Years later when you do wanna sell (and you WILL !@) this decision you make today will make selling your home a lot easier.

Good Luck. and I know I for one look forward to seeing photographic progress of this (beats the crap of the next tower "Speaker add" photographic experience ..........LOL !).

 

[Speedling]

Hey now, in order for that next tower thread i need the garage or i won't fit!

 

[MikeyL]

I apologize ...... You make excellent points and I added what I had MEANT to say ....... LOL ! All in fun, anyways.

Ya know, if ya think about this a bit, ya could cook up some BBQ, invite all of us jetboater.com forum members to come stay with you, and we could have our own Jet Boat Garage MakeOver Show and git this thing built in like 18 hours !!!!!!!!

'Jes sayin ! ............ LOL ! Sumptin' to consider !

 

[Speedling]

Lol nice
Plans and funds need to be right first!
I am trying to find a somewhat economical way to heat the garage during the winter if i have it detached. I would love love love to have radiant heat but it costs a lot to justify for a shop/garage. Maybe i could buy the lines and bury them and worry about the boiler etc later when cash allows. Windows are a must so maybe a bit of greenhouse effect will help. A friend of mine suggested burying some radiant floor line about 10-15 feet down and using earths heat to bring the garage up to about 50 degrees in the winter. Would just need a good pump to go constantly when the floor is below 50.

I would still owe the wife something bigger/better for the bedroom/bath. I was hoping that one project tackle both at once. An office would be nice as well. On the main level with family is desired because my last office was down in the dungeon and i disliked being away from everyone.