Yamaha vs. Scarab

[MonctonR1]

After our first summer on the water with the family in our 2009 AR230 the family has fallen in love with our time out together on the water. We’re in different lakes in Ontario and thinking about an upgrade for a few reasons:
1. Noise (Although I love the sound of the 10.5K RPM, wifey is getting sick of it)
2. Water Sports (Kids are getting really good at wakeboarding and without any speed control or ballast it’s not the best)

A local dealer has a 2016 Scarab 255 Wake with twin Rotax 250s. How does this compare with my AR230 from a comfort, convenience and sound level. Anyone made the switch?

 

[Luc Lafreniere]

I have nothing against Yamaha or Scarab, I chose Scarab because I needed a small boat and Yamaha didn't make one, so there was only one option. With that being said, this thread may be of interest to you. Bonus, it's not all arguing lol Pros and cons to each brand. https://jetboaters.net/threads/sold-my-yamaha-for-a-2020-255-scarab.23406/

 

[jEt_jAk]

I’ve had both. Both have pros and cons, the biggest benefit of Scarab is the low speed and reverse handling is miles ahead of Yamaha, it’s not even close. No mods needed. Biggest benefit of Yamaha is overall fit and finish and ease of working on it, also I much prefer the dash on Yamaha.

 

[Enduro900]

After our first summer on the water with the family in our 2009 AR230 the family has fallen in love with our time out together on the water. We’re in different lakes in Ontario and thinking about an upgrade for a few reasons:
1. Noise (Although I love the sound of the 10.5K RPM, wifey is getting sick of it)
2. Water Sports (Kids are getting really good at wakeboarding and without any speed control or ballast it’s not the best)

A local dealer has a 2016 Scarab 255 Wake with twin Rotax 250s. How does this compare with my AR230 from a comfort, convenience and sound level. Anyone made the switch?

I too have been looking strongly at both.....the hard part is that both do have pros and cons (scarab wins in performance/depending on the engine options, and low speed control). The 255 also has the flex seating which allows for 3 people to comfortably sit backwards watching the sports action (the 2 rear facing chairs plus the passenger seat swivels). Also the 255 legally seats 13/the comparable Yamaha’s 12.....and with 500hp should handle a full load and water sports. The 255 made before 7/16 will require the Superchargers be rebuilt at 200hrs.

Yamaha has a much bigger/better dealer network and more stable future outlook (Scarabs future is questionable which could hurt future re-sell).

Just curious, but what are they asking for the 255?

 

[jEt_jAk]

The other thing I will say is the Scarab or BRP engine seems much better tuned out the gate. No mods needed. There is no cavitation, better designed spark arrestor/ no need ribbon delete, pump cone, does not need fins or lateral thrusters, etc. With that being said I still prefer Yamaha since all these mods can be done and once done I think overall it is a better boat. That’s IMO.

 

[212s]

1. Noise (Although I love the sound of the 10.5K RPM, wifey is getting sick of it)

How about adding some sound deadening foam? It's cheap, simple to install, and works. It's what Yamaha has done to quiet down the noise in the newer models since about 2017. Saves you a lot of money.

2. Water Sports (Kids are getting really good at wakeboarding and without any speed control or ballast it’s not the best)

How about adding ballast to your boat? Not sure if it works, but RideSteady is an aftermarket speed control that might help?

A local dealer has a 2016 Scarab 255 Wake with twin Rotax 250s. How does this compare with my AR230 from a comfort, convenience and sound level. Anyone made the switch?

The newer Scarab will probably be more comfortable, about the same convenience, and a little lower engine noise.
Haven't owned both, but have wet tested and examined Glastron (too plain didn't even test it), Vortex 203 wet & 223 examine, Scarab 195 wet & 215 examine, Yamaha AR195 wet, 195s examine and 212s examine. We chose the Yamaha 212s.

The Vortex was nice but lacked dual captain's chairs, the Scarab had the chairs and same 250hp engines but we didn't like the tower and too much cheap plastic. The Yamaha had the chairs and tower we liked, and the layout was good and felt larger, especially the bow. Prices for the 212s/223 VRX/215 ID were all similar once optioned about the same. The kicker for us was the BoatTest numbers showed the Yamaha performed the same with regular fuel and no superchargers, which means cheaper operating costs, lower maintenance, and no SC whine (another selling point for us). Although HP ratings are not the same, performance is darn close...makes me wonder where the rating numbers come from:

212s - fast acceleration, cruises at 30 and 11gph tops out at 52mph and 25gph reg fuel
223/215 - fast acceleration, cruises at 30 and 11gph tops out at 53mph and 36gph prem fuel

And that's premium fuel at almost 50% more consumption at WOT. Keep the revs down and consumption is more reasonable, so it's not such a big deal...we were not overly concerned with fuel use, it's a boat and boats use a lot of fuel to have fun. It's just a bonus for us to run regular.

Another factor is newness...we had a 2000 boat and it was getting old, low tech, and lacked ride comfort with an 8 degree deadrise. We looked at used, but figured we might as well buy new and get exactly what we want.

That's my 2 cents...your needs and opinions will vary and hopefully these posts will help you make a decision that works for you.

 

[212s]

The other thing I will say is the Scarab or BRP engine seems much better tuned out the gate. No mods needed. There is no cavitation, better designed spark arrestor/ no need ribbon delete, pump cone, does not need fins or lateral thrusters, etc. With that being said I still prefer Yamaha since all these mods can be done and once done I think overall it is a better boat. That’s IMO.

I don't understand some of this...my 2020 boat doesn't wander as bad as the BRP equipped boats thanks to the AK, so I think the BRP needs fins while the newer model Yamaha doesn't. Did BRP change something?

 

[tdonoughue]

Guess my reaction is that if you are going that strongly toward the watersports with the kids and also the sound concerns, it is time to consider a true wake boat?

Yeah, maybe you stick with this for another season until the market settles and all--let the kids master the wake and all that you can do on the current boat. But then, what about the Axis or other offerings? I think we have a thread on here that is pretty active with lots of options that direction. Not that I want to see anyone going away from jets, but, let's face it, they serve a good purpose and then there are times when other platforms beat them.

 

[jEt_jAk]

I don't understand some of this...my 2020 boat doesn't wander as bad as the BRP equipped boats thanks to the AK, so I think the BRP needs fins while the newer model Yamaha doesn't. Did BRP change something?

I am primary speaking of slow speed handling.High speed the handling seemed about the same.

 

[212s]

I am primary speaking of slow speed handling.High speed the handling seemed about the same.

That's what I mean, running in no wake zones or around docks the BRP wanders all over the place without fins while trying to go straight. The Yamaha wanders about the same as my old stern drive, a bit but nothing like the BRP did. I'm surprised none of them have come up with counter rotating pumps in twins - that would cancel out a lot of the wandering.

 

[Enduro900]

That's what I mean, running in no wake zones or around docks the BRP wanders all over the place without fins while trying to go straight. The Yamaha wanders about the same as my old stern drive, a bit but nothing like the BRP did. I'm surprised none of them have come up with counter rotating pumps in twins - that would cancel out a lot of the wandering.

I think he is referring to maneuvering the boat around the docs and tight spaces (reverse, etc) using INR (intelligent neutral/reverse thrusters)

For low-speed driving most fin companies offer fins for BRP-based boats as well, So low speed forward driving they also need help tracking straight....

 

[Canuckjetboater]

Does the Scarab have a clean-out port like the Yamaha? A friend's SeaDoo is a PITA as he always has to stop and swim under his boat to clean-out weeds etc. I just do that from the swim platform.

 

[Enduro900]

Does the Scarab have a clean-out port like the Yamaha? A friend's SeaDoo is a PITA as he always has to stop and swim under his boat to clean-out weeds etc. I just do that from the swim platform.

No, Yamaha has a patent on the clean-out ports, and BRP has a patent on the reverse thrusters.....too bad they couldn’t trade

So we are left with trade-offs for each....

 

[OrangeTJ]

Are you open to considering other boats than jets or pretty set on jets? Only ask because some of the key features you seem to be seeking may be better represented in a v-drive watersports boat. Just something to consider.

 

[Enduro900]

Are you open to considering other boats than jets or pretty set on jets? Only ask because some of the key features you seem to be seeking may be better represented in a v-drive watersports boat. Just something to consider.

I’m leaning strong towards jets, but may consider a surf I/O. Chaparral makes a 21ft and 23ft surf that uses a forward facing prop and Malibu surf wake system, and they are priced in the $50k-$70k range.

 

[212s]

I’m leaning strong towards jets, but may consider a surf I/O. Chaparral makes a 21ft and 23ft surf that uses a forward facing prop and Malibu surf wake system, and they are priced in the $50k-$70k range.

I know what you mean - we wanted a new boat and looked at everything. But I wanted to go jet drive because of the lack of outdrive, low maintenance, lighter weight with twin engines, low profile engines for roominess and big swim platform, etc. My only reservation was debris in the impellers, but after 3 months the only issue was weeds wrapped around one shaft that was easy to clean. But it was so weedy that day at the ramp my dog could have walked across the water on them - never saw it that bad before, it was such a mess.

 

[212s]

No, Yamaha has a patent on the clean-out ports, and BRP has a patent on the reverse thrusters.....too bad they couldn’t trade
So we are left with trade-offs for each....

I wonder when the patents run out...might see cleanout ports on the BRP's one day soon.

 

[Evil Sports]

OP is driving a 12 year old boat. Perhaps he might try a newer edition Yamaha with lower revving engines and keel. That being said Jets will be jets and slow speed is their nemesis.

 

[JetTech72]

I don't understand some of this...my 2020 boat doesn't wander as bad as the BRP equipped boats thanks to the AK, so I think the BRP needs fins while the newer model Yamaha doesn't. Did BRP change something?

I don't agree that a BRP equipped system will wonder more than any other jetboat after you got used to it, in fact it's much more nimble around the dock than any Yamaha jet.
The iNR gives you the possibility to have a true neutral fore & aft, but at the same time, due to the lateral thrust out of those aluminum gate, permits you to spin the boat on it's own axis.
So when riding in low speed zone you can always bump your controller quickly in neutral and those massive gate will straight you out in an heart beat. On the other hand I agree that Yamaha do need to drag rudder because the tiny plastic reverse gate aren't big enough to straighten you out if you start fishtailing. The problem with the rudder is that it increases the turning radius of a Yamaha jetboat at higher speed, when compared to a Scarab or a Vortex.