Nylon Bolts = Bad

[Hector]

Thanks... not sure I would have been able to google that.

Just google rooster playing soccer...

 

[Foobar]

In the other thread the proverbial solution looking for a problem was proposed. Anyone with a bit of common sense could see ...

This was not a "bad idea". It was an idea that did not work. If you cannot (or refuse) to see how and object firmly bolted to the pumps hanging below the hull could not potentially cause a problem, then that is ok. It is your boat.

Anyone with a bit of common sense could see it was a bad idea.

Based on their opinion, not their testing. People said the same thing about Glock's "plastic" frame when they came out.

OP proposed, tested and claimed success in the other thread;

I specifically said upon visual inspection they looked fine and that I would be removing them later to check for problems.

In a rather arrogant and condescending tone.

Because some people have decided that their opinion is equal to actual testing and take it upon themselves to stuff it down people's throat as fact. Just like you saying "anyone with a bit of common sense could see ..." is your opinion. Not your test results, not your facts, your opinion.

Then shortly after started this thread saying it was a bad idea without saying anything in the other thread.

This isn't a pride thing as this statement insinuates. I could have easily just not said anything about the results I found when I disassembled the setup if I really cared about pride and saving face. I care about facts, truth, and integrity. This is why I posted the results I found.

 

[Foobar]

One other thing I would like to mention regarding opinions and facts; If someone would have said something like this:

"Based on testing, X newtons of force is placed upon the fins while turning at Y speed. This would exceed the Z rating of force for that material at that diameter."

I would have taken that as fact and not an opinion. Since I do not have the equipment to measure those variables myself, my only option was to bolt it onto the boat and test it.

 

[Foobar]

@the MfM I am not trying to single you out, so don't take it that way. Other people have said the same things and that is why I quoted it. I was guilty of having and idea, dared to talk about it, and had the gall to test it.

 

[swatski]

@Foobar I hope you will keep testing and posting!
Thank you for sharing!

--

 

[PeterB]

@Foobar There are no "failed" experiments. The results merely prove or disprove a theory. We all learn either way.
Thanks for sharing your results!

 

[bronze_10]

Can we all just get back to an obvious argument that no one can deny.. . Dodge is waaaay better than ford or chevy!

 

[Neutron]

Can we all just get back to an obvious argument that no one can deny.. . Dodge is waaaay better than ford or chevy!

Bull(sneeze)

 

[MidnightRider]

Yeah I don’t want to stir stuff up, I really enjoy this forum and it has a ton of extremely valuable information and I think it is also run very well. The whole fin thing just seems so triggered, maybe because the creators are on this forum (I get it, it’s their baby, and others are passionate about the products for literally changing their jet boating experience). So probably better just to stay out of it - I’m pretty sure the setup I’m going with at this point, at least til I change my mind . It’s enough to say I’ve found @Foobar comparison tests/vids the most helpful of anything on this forum in regards to fins so I’m appreciative of his time and contributions. Now back to boating cause we all can agree on our love for that.

 

[Jaylex]

I'm in the market for one of these steering systems and stumbled on this thread and hadn't thought about the fins hanging down.

On my previous jet boat, 242ls, I had the jbp fins, but was thinking of trying the cobras On my ar240 to switch it up.

My question is, and this test was actually super interesting and directly related to my question...which is has there been cause for concern with the cobras (or jbp for that matter) coming in contact with objects and causing unwanted damage?

I think like others, I also anchor stern to beach and would need to be cognizant of the depth to avoid to much contact with the bottom?

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

I'm in the market for one of these steering systems and stumbled on this thread and hadn't thought about the fins hanging down.

On my previous jet boat, 242ls, I had the jbp fins, but was thinking of trying the cobras On Mr ar240 to switch it up.

My question is, and this test was actually super interesting and directly related to my question...which is has there been cause for concern with the cobras (or jbp for that matter) coming in contact with objects and causing unwanted damage?

I think like others, I also anchor stern to beach and would need to be cognizant of the depth to avoid to much contact with the bottom?

Walking through landmines here... best I can tell is that someone (not named) started this theory with no evidence of it ever happening. I could be wrong, but from what I have seen it has never been an issue. With other parts of the boat hanging lower than steering product A, maybe steering product B as well, it would be damn near impossible to hit only the steering system and nothing else on the boat.

 

[Mainah]

It was not my intent to single anyone out. There had been plenty of posts from folks who thought that this was a problem that did not exist. In fact that is the camp my opinion lays in then and now but I did not need to add to the heap. My intent was to support someone who did not ask for it and that I do not know based on how they approached it. A good community needs many different types from fanboys, story tellers, jokesters, leaders, scientists, salesman etc. This is a concern that some folks have so he decided to test it for himself and post results. I admire someone who will put their theories to the test and be honest about it even when they don’t pan out.

@Foobar spent time and effort on all of his testing posts and videos. We need more like him to help us all make better informed decisions.

 

[MidnightRider]

I'm in the market for one of these steering systems and stumbled on this thread and hadn't thought about the fins hanging down.

On my previous jet boat, 242ls, I had the jbp fins, but was thinking of trying the cobras On Mr ar240 to switch it up.

My question is, and this test was actually super interesting and directly related to my question...which is has there been cause for concern with the cobras (or jbp for that matter) coming in contact with objects and causing unwanted damage?

I think like others, I also anchor stern to beach and would need to be cognizant of the depth to avoid to much contact with the bottom?

Walking through landmines here... best I can tell is that someone (not named) started this theory with no evidence of it ever happening. I could be wrong, but from what I have seen it has never been an issue. With other parts of the boat hanging lower than steering product A, maybe steering product B as well, it would be damn near impossible to hit only the steering system and nothing else on the boat.

In the interest of being thorough, there actually have been instances reported of the cobra fins being hit and bent up. However as also demonstrated the bracket that holds them in place is a “sacrificial” bracket by design and has demonstrated to take the force and bend out of the way as designed without any damage to the jets. It’s also been reported that these sacrificial brackets can be fairly easily bent back into useable state even in the field using common tools. So in summary it has happened but to be fair it does not seem to be a “problem” and I’d also agree that this is probably a rare occurance given their location. I personally have been satisfied by what I have read to the point that cobras have been what have landed on for my needs - although I also believe I will try the LTEs in combo with them.

 

[Brandon_SC]

@ttzz I agree. There’s no way I’d use a plastic bolt... long term UV damage is bad enough on the ones I’ve used on lawnmowers before... they became so very easy to break off from normal use.

 

[the MfM]

This is right up there with mad mike Hughes proving the world isn’t flat.

 

[Weeb]

I would like to thank @Foobar for all the tests he did I found them very informative. I just bought my boat in December and knew the short comings of jet boat steering so I put the Magnu AK system on with fangs. I upgraded to the mega fangs, which I haven't had out yet. At the time I didn't know about he LTE's but after reading @Foobar post I now know their an option with my fins. I'm not in currants but my wife did get pinned on the dock at the boat ramp by the wind so like others have said I can see how they would help push you off the dock. i wasn't to sure about the nylon bolt but I was interested in if it would work or not. I thought it was thinking outside the box but I now know it won't work thanks to @Foobar. So once again thank you @Foobar.

 

[swatski]

If someone here could test the reverse - with and w/o the MEGAs?
And post the results.

I did that and what I found was quite a boost in reverse with MEGAs, as compared to stock.
Maybe I need to go back and do it again?

I would be reluctant to lose that reverse advantage (which I think is real) by switching to LTEs, but I can totally see how in some situations/docking circumstances the LTEs would be a better mod.

Basically, to me it's like considering "AKs plus MEGAs" vs "AKs plus LTEs" - for the new 240 AK hulls, with the extra steering rod of course.


In my case, wanting a better reverse has been the reason I would consider manufacturing a bucket-based lateral thruster mod which, in combination with MEGAs and AKs, would have it all:

1. better forward control in "no wake" and "on plane"
   
2. reverse boost
   
3. lateral control

(Re: 3. the bucket lateral mods pictured in the link would in actuality be quite different, and a lot more streamlined, but that's another story)

--

 

[Ajax]

Can we all just get back to an obvious argument that no one can deny.. . Dodge is waaaay better than ford or chevy!

Except for when it comes to pick ups. Ford wins. The f in f-150 literally stands for fantastic.

 

[bronze_10]

Except for when it comes to pick ups. Ford wins. The f in f-150 literally stands for fantastic.

Lol. Mine stood for WHAT THE F&%# NOW!

 

[Sbrown]

Except for when it comes to pick ups. Ford wins. The f in f-150 literally stands for fantastic.

I thought it stood for "Flee!"